Hello guys. About 3 months ago I joined this site (in another name obvioously, since the site crashed)
And I asked about how I could use a Kislev army.
I got some GREAT advice from all of the forum members, and I decided to use my Kislev force as an allied contingent in an Empire army (which Ive now decided to be Ostland, with a few Middenheim soldiers which were requested by Von Raukov).
Anyhow, I was looking forward to being able to play the Kislev Kossars and cavalry with their TRUE points scores, thing as how I bought the kislev codex online. BUT, now I asked some people at my local GW, and they said that Allied contingents have been outlawed ever since some new release or something.
I dont see why, allied contingents made just fine sense, as long as they were accurate in the sense of evil or good forces...
Anyone know FOR SURE, what the deal is on this?
You can use the Kislev allies in fun games but not tournaments run by GW. If you are planning on going to an indy tournament ask fisrt but they probably will not have a problem with it.
I personally run a Slayer Army and Chaos Dwarf army and the GW store I go to has no problems with me playing them in the store for fun games.
Kislev haven't gotten any new update since 2003, to GW they are basically dead, just like Dogs of War.
At least they got an update since the last Chaos Dwarf update.
long live chaos dwarves! long live kislev! long live cathay! LONG LIVE FISHMEN!!!
Long live the Slayer Army of Karak Kadrin.
This beggs an interesting question: why is that the Dogs are so distained now, when they obviously enjoyed some decent amount of support in the past?
Well it was a chage in attitude of the game designers.
When they found Chaos players using Crossbows in their armies (personally I only ever saw one Chaos player use Rudlugs once) they decided that Dogs of War were a bad thing. This was about 3 months after they had a White Dwarf article about creating Pike units for each army.
Mercenaries have always been a part of war. Heck isn't that what the French Foreign Legion is (no Frenchman is allowed to join the foreign legion.)
(06-25-2009 09:27 PM)BilboBaggins Wrote: [ -> ]Well it was a chage in attitude of the game designers.
When they found Chaos players using Crossbows in their armies (personally I only ever saw one Chaos player use Rudlugs once) they decided that Dogs of War were a bad thing. This was about 3 months after they had a White Dwarf article about creating Pike units for each army.
Mercenaries have always been a part of war. Heck isn't that what the French Foreign Legion is (no Frenchman is allowed to join the foreign legion.)
Yep, plus I think they did it to make the fans happy. Just like Kislev and Chaos Dwarf. They come out with a Update/Book and then find something wrong with them. Plus the whole money thing, happening to make models for 12+ armies add up. But if you ask me I think it was the fact that people were playing armies other then the ones they wanted, Storm of Chaos and not there beloved Empire.
They also seem to have gotten away from conversions, it use to be getting people to convert models. The Chaos Dwarfs and Dogs of War are the ultimate conversion armies.
Plus It could be all the Ogres that end up in non-Ogre armies. alittle bit off track here, but remember the whole cathay thing. It anit china but then turn around put up a Cathay (china) army based on the Bretonnia, on the website. I think what GW needs to do is have an expert thing to the side, like with Chaos Dwarf if you buy this box and this box you can make this. not only will it help sells but that way all they have to do is make the Book/Codex for it.
As for Kislev, the main thing is the Glorious Charge rule, most of it is grounded in 6th core rules, so when 7th ed. came out most of that, when out the window. GW didn't fell like making a new book, so they killed it. (again) but I have a feeling they will be back.
Untill then just do what I'm doing, making an Empire army Based on the Kislev, for Trouments.
Winged Lancer (Knightly Order)
Gryphon Legion (Inner Circle Knights)
Ungol Horse Archers (Pistoliers)
Kislew Kossars (Free Company)
It ain't the same as playing a pure kislev, but I still get a smile when i hit someone with a 15-20 strong unit of Winged Lancer (Knightly Order) with the Banner of the Daemonslayer.
I'm just kind of baffled because the generic-ness of the Dogs of War list means that Games Workshop has a stopgap army that can be used to represent just about anything, without them having to spend time and money on a dedicated set of models or the printing of a glossy book.
Want to play the guys from Estalia? Use the Dogs. Need an Arabyan list? Use the Dogs.
Their theory currently is that people can use Empire and Bretonnia to do that, and some have.
It used to be a Bretonnia thing of no Dogs of War, now they want to try it with all armies. I'm guessing that the next Ogre Kingdoms book will remove them from being used in other armies.
The problem with this plan is that it takes some of the individuality people had in making their armies look cool.
The nice thing about Dogs of War is that you can use almost any model in them. My regular paymaster is the (very) old Empire General, with lance, shield, heavy armour and barded warhorse, he can contribute quite nicely to a heavy cav unit. If I wanted a level 4 death wizard on Pegasus I'd just grab the Dark Elf Morathai model (which I might do anyway, it's really nice) for Ogre Ironguts I have minotaurs with great weapons (I had the old limited edition Empire standard bearer, the local store manager was willing to exchange 4 blisters from the stock he was clearing for it, four minotaur blisters later...) although possibly sticking to normal Ogre rules would be more appropriate as they don't look like they'd have Bull Charge... oh wait they have bull heads. I have the Bretonnian Pegasus model that I'm sure would make a good Captain with sword of might for hunting war machines and the like.
Want some Witch Elves? Just call them Norse Bezerkers. Need some light cavalry, recruit some Goblin Wolf Riders. Dwarves? Yes please. Duellists, how about some Skaven Gutter Runners or Empire Militia?
I have the old metal volley gun that can be a small cannon (it's a whole heap of small cannon strapped together). Also the Freelancer makes a very cool Captain.
Of course on top of that there's the great Dogs of War models from 5th and 6th edition. They can be pricy now, but I got most of mine when local GW was clearing them out at "buy a box and get three blisters free" rates. Slayer pirates, small cannon dragged by horses, fearless pikemen, BS4 crossbowmen, Mydas, Lucreccia, Borgio (he's the man) and Lorenzo, frickin' guys who fly around with pedal pushing wings, Gotrek and Felix, and the Witchhunters (a warrior priest and a vampire killer as a rare choice? Why not?) A werebear... a werebear. The models are characterful and generally unique to the army. Oh and they can take a dragon, though unfortunately I don't have the model, but I could still use the new High Elf dragon anyway.
What's not to like? Okay the special characters use a hero and lord slot, so at 3000 that's Lucreccia, Borgio, Mydas, and one other (level 2 scroll caddy), but then you get heroes with your units too so you're not missing out that much. Okay they're overcosted, but what the heck...
Although I'm not sure who said it, if you have the rules for the Dogs of War then you also have the rules for including them in your army (for example any army can take Ricco's Republican Guard as a special choice). You don't need an entry in the respective army book to allow it.